Muriatic Acid - sealed, in a bag, in a steel drawer - looks like rust under the bag!?

I recently listened to these books (I'm an audiobook junkie). The two by Sam Kean are excellent. Liquid Rules is pretty good. All three talk about the dangers of chemical interaction even with solids. If I didn't already have a fascination and respect for chemistry before these, I would after.

Liquid Rules: The Delightful and Dangerous Substances That Flow Through Our Lives by Mark Miodownik

The Disappearing Spoon: And Other True Tales of Madness, Love, and the History of the World from the Periodic Table of the Elements by Sam Kean

Caesar's Last Breath: Decoding the Secrets of the Air Around Us by Sam Kean

Neil

Back when my dad had his chemical company in Boulder, Colorado, there was a release of chlorine gas from a process and it vented outside - right over the Putt-Putt Golf course next door! Yeah, the same stuff chemical weapons use.

Dad ran out to the factory floor to help contain the rest of the mess, and his brother raced off to the emergency room and handed out business cards to the families who came in to seek care, telling them they would cover all costs.

Ah! The good old days of actually being responsible for your mistakes (though, having the vent tube point towards the Putt-Putt was probably not the best decision to begin with!)

Thanks for the suggestions on the books - I read voraciously and continually. I'll get 'em from the library and read 'em.

I like the short 'threatening film' - I gotta get some of that stuff!

I've been reading Helen Czerski's book "Storm in a Teacup" about the physics of everyday things. Really good! Her description of surface tension is fantastic.

MBTW: LIquid helium is weird stuff. Its a superfluid and will simply leak through glass and drip out the bottom of a flask. Now, you have to get it down to 2.71 degrees KELVIN (which is minus -454.792 degrees fahrenheit). Here's a youtube video about that:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FudzqfpLLs

Oh, and here's a SciAM article about liquid helium

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jdurand

When the lady who caused the spill woke up in the hospital she found out a male (horrors!) worker carried her into the emergency shower and tore the acid soaked clothing off her. She accused him of attempted rape.

I think "thank you" would be more appropriate.

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As a first responder that's one of the many issues we have to deal with, these days any suspicion of a female being an adherent to certain religions is enough reason not to touch or treat, lest a male guardian seeks to avenge the loss of family honour. One female student who was treated by a male first responder was honour killed when she returned home, religion of peace my arse.

Today in this country I would be vary wary about helping ANYBODY. Of course I'm in California , one of the places you can get beat bloody with a "LOVE" sign.

I'm also careful of who I talk to and what I say.

Maybe I failed to follow this thread very close but! OOPS! I think I'll keep my mouth shut.

I know I'm a bit late to the party, but being an actual chemist I feel like I should chime in.

As others have said, HCl solutions are rather volatile, especially so if kept somewhere it gets warm. Stock acid bottles come with Teflon-lined caps, but these are mainly to prevent liquid leaks and the interface between the liner and the rim of the bottle is the major route for leakage of HCl vapor. The flexible polyethylene bag acts as a bit of a barrier, but it too is porous and cannot withstand any lengthy exposure to strong mineral acids.

What likely happened is that over time (and probably aided by temperature cycling), you start to build up HCl and water vapor inside the bag, which condenses and runs down to the bottom. It can then permeate through the bottom of the bag, soften the paint, and begin to dissolve the steel of your cabinet. The liquid now contains ferrous chloride, which can permeate back through the polyethylene bag -- this is how you could end up with rust-colored liquid inside the bag, though it should be limited to the bottom where it was in contact with the drawer.

As for safe storage, the ideal situation is a polyethylene- or polypropylene-lined cabinet with built-in ventilation. Most labs I've worked in had the acid cabinets built into the fume hoods, with an air path that would draw air through the cabinet and up into the fume hood. Barring that, it's always a good idea to keep acid bottles in thick polyethylene/polypropylene secondary containers of a large enough volume to keep everything contained in the unlikely event that the bottles rupture. We used polypropylene trays and polyethylene dishes in my lab.

As for segregation, no mineral acid should be stored in the same container (cabinet) as combustible/flammable materials, as this can lead to some very nasty reactions. Furthermore, you should take care to segregate your oxidizing acids (nitric and sulfuric) from both each other and from the HCl. In our lab we only had one acid cabinet, so the nitric and sulfuric acids each had their own thick plastic dishes to keep anything from mixing if the bottles broke. Nitric and HCl form aqua regia when mixed in the right proportion, which can dissolve gold and will produce extremely toxic nitrogen dioxide gas. Mixing nitric and sulfuric is an even worse idea, as it is capable of nitrating almost any organic material (wood, plastic, etc.) and the results tend to be explosive. Granted, these mixtures require very concentrated acids [37% HCl (12 M), 70% nitric (16 M), and 96% sulfuric (18 M)], but why risk anything?